April 3, 2010 at 7:12 pm
Dear All:
Not sure whether I am posting in the right place, hopefully I am. I have been managing two small databases (few Mgs each) running on SQL server 2005. When I started I hardly new anything about SQL server besides the basic SQL quires and relational database stuff I learnt at school many years ago.
I have finished my Bachelor of Business IT 10 years a go on part time basis while working at a private college as a transport coordinator. After I finished my degree I started doing a bit of IT work at the same college (support and networking). Later on I became responsible for the SQL server which was added to our IT infrastructure.
I have been managing the databases now for almost two years. The system is very stable and there is very small interaction with users. I am just doing the usual regular backups and creating some basic reports. On the other hand I thought this might be my last opportunity to get some experience and get into the industry and do one job as DBA, then build on the experience. However each time I do research about becoming a DBA I reach a dead end and I loose my stamina. Some of the things I come across:
Learning Oracle is a must if I want get anywhere in the industry.
DBA’s are among the highest paid in the industry therefore very competitive and therefore difficult to get into
Organisation are very careful about trusting their data to someone therefore the selection criteria is very tough
Just some of the things I come across. Considering the fact I turned 40 this year, with very little experience if any in SQL server do I stand any chance?, or is it too late for me?
If not how can I speed tracks my career and where to start. Many question in my mind and looking for your generous advice.
Sam
Kind regards
April 4, 2010 at 12:37 am
For the beginning check this http://qa.sqlservercentral.com/articles/DBA/68526/
Never say Never, Never is too late...everyday we learn new things....!
And take a look one quote here
I wish you success....!
April 4, 2010 at 3:01 pm
Learning Oracle is a must if I want get anywhere in the industry.
I'm convinced that Larry wrote that himself. Ignore it or act on it but don't worry about it.
DBA’s are among the highest paid in the industry therefore very competitive and therefore difficult to get into.
It's not difficult... you've already taken the first step. Take the next step.
Organisation are very careful about trusting their data to someone therefore the selection criteria is very tough.
Heh... not from what I've seen in some companies. Based on your caution and your good statements you've made so far, I think you have the where-with-all to make a difference and actually offer a company something they may have never had... a data gate-keeper.... someone who actually cares about the data. Again, take the next step.
Just some of the things I come across. Considering the fact I turned 40 this year, with very little experience if any in SQL server do I stand any chance?, or is it too late for me?
If not how can I speed tracks my career and where to start. Many question in my mind and looking for your generous advice.
Some will say to take the time to get "certified". I'll say that if you take that time, take the time to actually learn something instead of just memorizing to pass the test. Buy a copy of SQL Server Developer's Edition (which is really the Enterprise Edition with certain licensing and will work on your desktop without Windows Server) for around 40 to 50 bucks. Then do that which is essential to your success... study, practice, study, practice, study, practice... start answering questions on forums (they're "real life" problems) and study, practice, study, practice, study, practice... volunteer some of your DBA skills to charitable organizations (which is the "Next Step" I've spoken of)... they'll be happy to have you and they look good on a resume. Learn how to write a resume... put your accomplishments up front in the first section and call it "Recent Accomplishments".
And, no... 40 is not too old but let me ask you... is data and performance of data your passion or not? If it's not, you may want to reconsider because it is a bit of a demanding mistress.
--Jeff Moden
April 4, 2010 at 3:06 pm
P.S. There are two huge discussions after articles on the problem of "FizzBuzz". Read the discussions (search for them first, obviously) and understand the difference between someone who can simply solve the problem and someone who can solve the problem correctly using set based techniques. It's a classic example of how to blow the competition away and how to think of data and performance. Don't skip or gloss over any of the discussion... read it all.
--Jeff Moden
April 5, 2010 at 6:53 am
Most DBA in the team I work with are over 40 years old; not too late for you.
Reading your post it looks like you have some exposure to SQL Server so for starters I will pursue the SQL Server avenue.
Write a nice resume focusing on a entry level SQL Server DBA position and start interviewing; you will be amazed of how much you will learn during interviews. Don't expect to get hired on the first, second or even perhaps the tenth interview but keep trying. Each time go back home and master whatever sunk you in the particular case.
If you are serious about it, try MS SQL Server training and examinations. Not looking for a certification which will be nice to have but to force you to read and practice about everything.
Once you get a SQL Server job start with Oracle. Go to Oracle home, download the current version of Oracle, start practicing and... by this time you will know the drill.
Good luck.
_____________________________________
Pablo (Paul) Berzukov
Author of Understanding Database Administration available at Amazon and other bookstores.
Disclaimer: Advice is provided to the best of my knowledge but no implicit or explicit warranties are provided. Since the advisor explicitly encourages testing any and all suggestions on a test non-production environment advisor should not held liable or responsible for any actions taken based on the given advice.April 5, 2010 at 2:48 pm
Jeff Moden (4/4/2010)
Learning Oracle is a must if I want get anywhere in the industry.
I'm convinced that Larry wrote that himself. Ignore it or act on it but don't worry about it.
Some will say to take the time to get "certified". I'll say that if you take that time, take the time to actually learn something instead of just memorizing to pass the test. Buy a copy of SQL Server Developer's Edition (which is really the Enterprise Edition with certain licensing and will work on your desktop without Windows Server) for around 40 to 50 bucks. Then do that which is essential to your success... study, practice, study, practice, study, practice... start answering questions on forums (they're "real life" problems) and study, practice, study, practice, study, practice... volunteer some of your DBA skills to charitable organizations (which is the "Next Step" I've spoken of)... they'll be happy to have you and they look good on a resume. Learn how to write a resume... put your accomplishments up front in the first section and call it "Recent Accomplishments".
I agree with Jeff on the Oracle topic. Learning Oracle is a requirement if you feel you want to take that route.
I also agree with Jeff on purchasing the Developer Edition of SQL Server. Learn the product. Follow discussions here at SSC and try to solve them yourself. It will be well worth the investment if you put in some time and effort.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 5, 2010 at 2:49 pm
Jeff Moden (4/4/2010)
P.S. There are two huge discussions after articles on the problem of "FizzBuzz". Read the discussions (search for them first, obviously) and understand the difference between someone who can simply solve the problem and someone who can solve the problem correctly using set based techniques. It's a classic example of how to blow the competition away and how to think of data and performance. Don't skip or gloss over any of the discussion... read it all.
Yes, there are some very good discussions revolving around FizzBuzz. There are also probably some good blogs out there on the topic as well - some good, some less so.
There are also plenty of other topics, questions, discussions of great value here at SSC.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 5, 2010 at 2:52 pm
PaulB-TheOneAndOnly (4/5/2010)
Most DBA in the team I work with are over 40 years old; not too late for you.Reading your post it looks like you have some exposure to SQL Server so for starters I will pursue the SQL Server avenue.
Write a nice resume focusing on a entry level SQL Server DBA position and start interviewing; you will be amazed of how much you will learn during interviews. Don't expect to get hired on the first, second or even perhaps the tenth interview but keep trying. Each time go back home and master whatever sunk you in the particular case.
If you are serious about it, try MS SQL Server training and examinations. Not looking for a certification which will be nice to have but to force you to read and practice about everything.
Once you get a SQL Server job start with Oracle. Go to Oracle home, download the current version of Oracle, start practicing and... by this time you will know the drill.
Good luck.
This is a good method to quickly find stop gaps in your knowledge. Performing interviews can be a drain if you are expecting a lot of success. A potential negative of doing things this way is that you could go through a lot of interviews, not knowing your stuff, and possibly sour a future potential employer. Be careful and use a little moderation.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 5, 2010 at 3:00 pm
A lot of the answers to your questions will depend on your local job market.
For example, there are a lot of jobs where I am that don't require any Oracle knowledge at all, just SQL Server. There are other markets where it's the other way around, and some where either one is good. You'll need to find that out through whatever means companies in that market post job listings.
As far as competitive job hunting goes, when I was recently job hunting, I got five interviews in one week, and every single one of them wanted follow-ups. I know another DBA who spent six months doing interviews in the same area before he got a job offer. A lot of this will depend on your resume, your credentials, and the job market.
Check those factors out.
And realize that being a DBA is a tough job. It requires a lot of ongoing study and a lot of ability to handle both intense pressure and extreme boredom equally well. That's why it pays well: not many people can do those things.
If you find there's a market for it in your area, and you think you can handle those factors, then go for it. It can be a very rewarding career, both in satisfaction and financially. Very mentally challenging, which is highly satisfying if that's your thing.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
April 5, 2010 at 6:07 pm
CirquedeSQLeil (4/5/2010)
Jeff Moden (4/4/2010)
P.S. There are two huge discussions after articles on the problem of "FizzBuzz". Read the discussions (search for them first, obviously) and understand the difference between someone who can simply solve the problem and someone who can solve the problem correctly using set based techniques. It's a classic example of how to blow the competition away and how to think of data and performance. Don't skip or gloss over any of the discussion... read it all.Yes, there are some very good discussions revolving around FizzBuzz. There are also probably some good blogs out there on the topic as well - some good, some less so.
There are also plenty of other topics, questions, discussions of great value here at SSC.
Yep... my point is that there's more than one way to skin the proverbial cat and while a lot of them look right, they're not. The FizzBuzz discussions show how a great many people with disagree with a DBA in the future with all sorts of, ummmm, excuses for doing things in a less than optimal fashion. It's one of the things that new DBA's should be made aware of so that 1) they can prepare themselves, 2) they're made aware that "good enough" frequently is not, 3) that people make some really lame excuses for not doing things correctly (heh... like their job), 4) that it usually takes less time and code to do things in a proper set-based manner and gives better results, and 5) that in the face of all that is unholy (bad schedules, programmers that just want to get the job done, etc) that a DBA has to stand his/her ground for what they know is right.
--Jeff Moden
April 5, 2010 at 6:51 pm
GSquared (4/5/2010)
A lot of the answers to your questions will depend on your local job market.For example, there are a lot of jobs where I am that don't require any Oracle knowledge at all, just SQL Server. There are other markets where it's the other way around, and some where either one is good. You'll need to find that out through whatever means companies in that market post job listings.
As far as competitive job hunting goes, when I was recently job hunting, I got five interviews in one week, and every single one of them wanted follow-ups. I know another DBA who spent six months doing interviews in the same area before he got a job offer. A lot of this will depend on your resume, your credentials, and the job market.
Check those factors out.
And realize that being a DBA is a tough job. It requires a lot of ongoing study and a lot of ability to handle both intense pressure and extreme boredom equally well. That's why it pays well: not many people can do those things.
If you find there's a market for it in your area, and you think you can handle those factors, then go for it. It can be a very rewarding career, both in satisfaction and financially. Very mentally challenging, which is highly satisfying if that's your thing.
Very true, every DBA I know, and certainly myself, know's the days where you spend severn hours pointlessly surfing the web and emailing every pointless article to friends...then there's the week's wher you work 60 hours and are still behind.
The best interview advice I can give, if you don't know the answer, be straight forward, say you don't know...but tell them you can find the answer if the situation comes up.
One of the things I have found most often while interviewing, is that people will frequently ask questions that pertain to (A) a problem that has recently arisen in their organization, or (B) a set of questions unique to thier orginization.
With (A), sometimes people ask just to see if you have run into the problem, and a almost asking your opinion. So not knowing the answer is not a problem. Or if you know the answer, they may actually go back and research what you have said to consider implementation, something I have done.
With (B), it can really be a unique situation. It's a toss up whether they want you to have experience with it (old-timer's usually do, since that's how they have been working you 10 years), or if they don't care (you can pick up their excentricities in a week).
I will end with one final tidbit of advice. I once interviewed a dude who had with him SQL Server for Dummies...don't bring in reference material like that, it really says that you don't know what your doing. Do respectable mid/sr level DBA would be reading a "For Dummies" book. Don't bring in any reference material, leave it in the car.
/* ----------------------------- */
Tochter aus Elysium, Wir betreten feuertrunken, Himmlische, dein Heiligtum!
April 11, 2010 at 12:28 am
saghbash (4/3/2010)
how can I speed tracks my career and where to start. Many question in my mind and looking for your generous advice.
these type of FORUM also provide you good help as you can find here real time problem their solution and different opinion/advises
-------Bhuvnesh----------
I work only to learn Sql Server...though my company pays me for getting their stuff done;-)
April 11, 2010 at 2:57 am
Dear All:
the response for my post was overwhelming. I would like to thank all the good people for their advise. thank you for the guidance and the inspiration.
your words inspired me to try every step of the way.
Kind regards
April 11, 2010 at 10:04 am
You're welcome.
Jason...AKA CirqueDeSQLeil
_______________________________________________
I have given a name to my pain...MCM SQL Server, MVP
SQL RNNR
Posting Performance Based Questions - Gail Shaw[/url]
Learn Extended Events
April 14, 2010 at 4:04 am
Initially, I also have the same fears/questions that you have. If it makes it any better, I started my career by taking in calls as a tech support person. I only came across databases at the 3rd year of my career as tech support. From there I applied a lateral career shift/move from being a call-center tech support to being a Jr. DBA.
Experience teaches us most. We are expected to not go wrong at the production level, but we all learn from mistakes.
To alleviate that dilemma, I suggest that you make the most mistakes and try to solve them on an production-identical, test environment. Read
I am a DBA now, and I already learned a lot. There is one thing I will tell you though...
Learning doesn't stop. We only stop learning new things when we're dead.
I hope I inspired you to continue your career as DBA..
http://babolnart.wordpress.com/
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