November 1, 2016 at 8:40 am
Gary Varga (11/1/2016)
It seems a little worrying how many will not use the command line. I am not referring to your average citizen but your average IT professional. I have seen IT professionals ignore search engine hits whose resolution required some console interaction.In my experience, those who are most likely to be console shy are those who have found a career in IT after completing a non-IT degree or those who have changed careers e.g. being plucked out of a company's customer service team. This isn't always the case, of course.
I think that's certainly going to bite some IT professionals in the behind soon, MS seems pretty intent on not building fancy GUI tools anymore in favor of power shell options for administrative tasks. A perfect example would the lack of any kind of decent built in file search tool in windows, functionality that was actually made worse in newer versions of windows. Now sure that's perfectly easy to do very powerfully in power shell, if your comfortable with a command line 😀
November 1, 2016 at 9:24 am
Very good article, Steve. I think you make several good points. One that I want to emphasize is at the end. That's to ask someone struggling with some technical issue more so you can get a handle on their frame of reference. I think I've too often thought they were incompetent. Much to my shame for having thought that.
Now I want to bring up something different. I've been in this field for many years and have seen lots. I started out at the command line (VMS systems with DCL) and have also done some Unix (cshell and Korn shell). But back then there was less to learn. I really thought that it would be possible to know just about everything there was to know about some software system or OS. However, today the advancement of technology is so fast and on so many fronts it has made me realize that there's just too much for me, at least, to "learn it all". There are going to be things I'll never know. That, too me, is sad as I had always thought I could possibly know it all. In a sense a little death has occurred in me, having to give up that assumption. But in a way your article shows me that people can get along without knowing it all. After all, when connecting a new computer to a Wi-Fi router it isn't necessary to know how to do it at the command line. Using Windows (or whatever OS you're using) GUI is normally sufficient to the task. Or put differently, we've got other things to do and have to get on with it.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
November 1, 2016 at 9:27 am
BWFC (11/1/2016)
I'm one of those that was 'plucked out of a company's customer service team' and I know what you mean...That's not to say I won't consider using it the future though. Learning more about something is rarely a bad thing.
I have worked with many very talented people who have come via an "alternate" route. Every way to categorise people seems to have a small amount of bad apples and a small amount of diamonds.
Gaz
-- Stop your grinnin' and drop your linen...they're everywhere!!!
November 1, 2016 at 9:51 am
ZZartin (11/1/2016)
I think that's certainly going to bite some IT professionals in the behind soon, MS seems pretty intent on not building fancy GUI tools anymore in favor of power shell options for administrative tasks. A perfect example would the lack of any kind of decent built in file search tool in windows, functionality that was actually made worse in newer versions of windows. Now sure that's perfectly easy to do very powerfully in power shell, if your comfortable with a command line 😀
The move to cloud computing, and the necessity to have a lightweight interface to control multiple remote machines seems to have changed Microsoft's direction recently. SSH and a command line make Linux admins very productive and this is the model that they have copied. Decoupling the graphics server architecture from the actual desktop, a la X-Server, would be too difficult with the Windows code base. It might be nice to see this in the future however.
I know there is the GNUWin library, but I would like to see a native GPL'd version of Grep,SED and AWK for Windows. But I think that this was the purpose of the Ubuntu-on-windows project.
November 1, 2016 at 9:58 am
Lynn Pettis (11/1/2016)
I used to know the command line. Guess I'll need to refresh my knowledge, hopefully it is like riding a bike.
It is. In fact, using the command line is like writing T-SQL to me in many cases. do something, click go, and see results.
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November 1, 2016 at 9:58 am
kenn 46875 (11/1/2016)
Great article and good points to consider, Thanks
You are welcome
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November 1, 2016 at 10:01 am
Rod at work (11/1/2016)
Very good article, Steve. I think you make several good points. One that I want to emphasize is at the end. That's to ask someone struggling with some technical issue more so you can get a handle on their frame of reference. I think I've too often thought they were incompetent. Much to my shame for having thought that.Now I want to bring up something different. I've been in this field for many years and have seen lots. I started out at the command line (VMS systems with DCL) and have also done some Unix (cshell and Korn shell). But back then there was less to learn. I really thought that it would be possible to know just about everything there was to know about some software system or OS. However, today the advancement of technology is so fast and on so many fronts it has made me realize that there's just too much for me, at least, to "learn it all". There are going to be things I'll never know. That, too me, is sad as I had always thought I could possibly know it all. In a sense a little death has occurred in me, having to give up that assumption. But in a way your article shows me that people can get along without knowing it all. After all, when connecting a new computer to a Wi-Fi router it isn't necessary to know how to do it at the command line. Using Windows (or whatever OS you're using) GUI is normally sufficient to the task. Or put differently, we've got other things to do and have to get on with it.
It is interesting to think about this. Most of us don't know how electricity works in our house, or what's inside our car. I'm certain some could puzzle out general concepts, but not know much about replacing parts or maintaining the items.
I think that's OK, and certainly I don't want a highly paid senior dev to be changing hard drives. However, I also want to try to ensure people improve themselves in ways which do benefit their work.
I also hope we have some appreciation that there are some strange gaps in knowledge between us.
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November 1, 2016 at 1:09 pm
I read a blog post about a bloke in a coffee shop who was approached by an old man who turned out to have been one of the most important characters in the history of computing.
The gist of the tale eas that he didn't like tablets because they turn us into dumb consumers rather than active experimenters. I have to say I agree with him. When my Nexus7 goes to silicon heaven I won't replace it. It burns too much time that would be better spent elsewhere.
The GUI is fine for office applications but the majority of what I do has to be repeatable in multiple environments through automated means. Once you start down the automation route you start designing for automation and testability. That precludes the use of the GUI.
November 1, 2016 at 11:23 pm
parksk (11/1/2016)
I always find it humorous handing a senior developer a screwdriver and new hard drive. 😛 As a systems engineer, hardware is second nature. But someone who spends all day behind a computer doesn't know what inside it.
Weeeeeell, there you got me!!! My boss thought at some point that I should learn about a computer's insides but it was useless. I am just not the hardware sort of man!!:w00t::w00t::w00t::w00t::w00t:
Manie Verster
Developer
Johannesburg
South Africa
I am happy because I choose to be happy.
I just love my job!!!
November 1, 2016 at 11:36 pm
It is interesting to think about this. Most of us don't know how electricity works in our house, or what's inside our car. I'm certain some could puzzle out general concepts, but not know much about replacing parts or maintaining the items.
My wife believes a man should be able to fix things around the house. My problem is when I touch a tool all my fingers turns to thumbs and I just can't seem to get it right. For instance, she says her iron packed up and can I please see if I can't fix it. I say: "Go buy a new one. If I open that thing it's going to end up in the dustbin." At least try she says. It ends up in the dustbin. My father, who was the handy man kind of guy, could never understand why I could not do what he did!! :hehe::hehe::hehe::hehe::hehe::hehe:
Manie Verster
Developer
Johannesburg
South Africa
I am happy because I choose to be happy.
I just love my job!!!
November 2, 2016 at 1:04 am
Over the years I have had to learn a bit about most things and although some things really weren't my boat I benefitted. This was because they gave context to my primary role and informed my design choices.
I've learned enough about AWS security to be more comfortable with cloud deployment and to spot basic security flaws.
I've learned a little bit about SAN storage and that hammered home some of the lessons from Thomas Kesjer
I've learned loads about onshore/offshore and project management.
I've learned about the dreadful algebra of necessity in management roles and what to expect from outsourcing to large IT corporations. Mainly to take my expectations out to the North Staffs coal field and drop them down a disused shaft.
Above all I've learned to communicate with people whose professions are different from my own.
Yes, I've retained my core skills but I can now think to apply them in more innovative and productive ways.
November 2, 2016 at 4:14 am
I'm quite pleased when clients know what batch files and scripts are. But it's more common to have to explain or add an additional task to my project than it is to find a competent IT admin than can do elementary CLI or basic scripts.
November 2, 2016 at 8:30 am
David.Poole (11/1/2016)
I read a blog post about a bloke in a coffee shop who was approached by an old man who turned out to have been one of the most important characters in the history of computing.The gist of the tale eas that he didn't like tablets because they turn us into dumb consumers rather than active experimenters. I have to say I agree with him. When my Nexus7 goes to silicon heaven I won't replace it. It burns too much time that would be better spent elsewhere.
The GUI is fine for office applications but the majority of what I do has to be repeatable in multiple environments through automated means. Once you start down the automation route you start designing for automation and testability. That precludes the use of the GUI.
I think you make a very good point, David. Generally speaking the advent of tablets is making more people into just consumers of news, entertainment or whatever. We're becoming less productive and creative. I like my Surface 3, but will always have a desktop or laptop around, so that I can produce and be creative.
Kindest Regards, Rod Connect with me on LinkedIn.
November 2, 2016 at 8:36 am
Rod at work (11/2/2016)
David.Poole (11/1/2016)
I read a blog post about a bloke in a coffee shop who was approached by an old man who turned out to have been one of the most important characters in the history of computing.The gist of the tale eas that he didn't like tablets because they turn us into dumb consumers rather than active experimenters. I have to say I agree with him. When my Nexus7 goes to silicon heaven I won't replace it. It burns too much time that would be better spent elsewhere.
The GUI is fine for office applications but the majority of what I do has to be repeatable in multiple environments through automated means. Once you start down the automation route you start designing for automation and testability. That precludes the use of the GUI.
I think you make a very good point, David. Generally speaking the advent of tablets is making more people into just consumers of news, entertainment or whatever. We're becoming less productive and creative. I like my Surface 3, but will always have a desktop or laptop around, so that I can produce and be creative.
Oh, but these tablets and other mobile devices enable the lay public to be even more creative and productive when it comes to social media. :rolleyes:
"Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the wise. Instead, seek what they sought." - Matsuo Basho
November 7, 2016 at 10:20 am
Not to sound dim but what is "to RMT" in "or telling them to RTM"?
Otherwise great article:-D.
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