September 26, 2008 at 6:45 am
I am in the process of upgrading our main production box from 2000 to 2005. I know 2005 has been out for a while, but we finally got our new server and I finally have some free time to upgrade it.
My opinion of 2005 so far : I would love to find the main developer of Management Studio and give him a swift kick in the crotch.
Gripes:
1. Most DBAs have to manage indexes from time to time (sarcastic tone). It would be nice to be able to have easy access to a nice list of indexes and all of the columns they include in one screen - LIKE 2000 HAD. A good idea to bring this list up, would be . . . I don't know . . . maybe by right-clicking on a table then have it in the list? Is that just too obvious? Why do I have to go 'design' the table, then go view indexes? I won't even go into the dangers of someone editing a table just to change an index.
2. The interface to manage indexes is horrible. They didn't even make the dialog box that comes up sizeable!!!! If I have a static table with many indexes, then I have to basically memorize them as I click on each one if I am trying to find any redundancy. I can't see what columns are referenced in one dialog box.
3. If I design a table that's already in place and I move the seperator bar up, then close the window, it doesn't remember where the bar was. If the table only has 3-5 columns, why not have the seperator bar up farther? This seems to be the standard throughout Management Studio.
4. How do I easily view how much free data/trans space is in my database? The only way I've found through Management Studio so far is the Disk Usage report. This shows me how much space I have free per file, but I still have to add all of the numbers up to find the number of GB I have free in my database. What if I have 5-6 data files and I want to know how much total free space I have? The percentage doesn't do me much good if the percentage is something like 13.74% and my database size is 144.322GB. I would have to get a calculator out to find out the exact amount.
5. The interface for viewing running jobs is ok, but to get to it is kind of a pain. It also doesn't remember the sizing changes I made to it when I closed it. If I click on Job Activity Monitor, wouldn't it make sense to show the Job Activity in the Object Explorer Details? Why when I start a job does it give me an extra dialog box to close? Just update the job's line in the activity monitor.
6. Why the hell would I want to open a browser window inside of management studio? If I am testing a website, then I want to see what it looks like to my users. Chances are my users don't have Management Studio installed so why would I want to test my webpage with it? The time spent putting this 'option' into Management Studio should have been put into usablity of the interface.
I'm really trying not to be negative about 2005, but I get the feeling that they are trying to make Management Studio more like Access. When I use Access I feel like I am trying to make fine art with crayons. I am a long time user of 2000 and started with SQL Server back before 6.5.
I think the same person that designed the Windows Mobile phone interface had a hand in designing Management Studio. (the Windows Mobile phone interface is horrible!!!)
I'm really hoping that 2005's 64bit engine really shines and makes up for the lackluster interface that I have to put up with. I've only been using the product for about 2-3 weeks, so hopefully my opinion will change in the future. Hopefully I'm just not finding these options and they are somewhere in the interface and I can retract these above statement.
September 26, 2008 at 8:58 am
It does take some getting used to.
I do prefer the query editing interface better in SSMS, but it does suffer with some weaknesses. The "not remember window settings" is something I don't like either.
That being said on your gripes #1 and #2: have you tried clicking the + next to the table? If you open up the indexes list, and right click the index, you do in fact get a much more useable interface (sizeable and all). Now - why you have 2 separate flavors of the editing interface for an index is not something I can answer....
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Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part...unless you're my manager...or a director and above...or a really loud-spoken end-user..All right - what was my emergency again?
September 26, 2008 at 9:39 am
Ok, that is a little better way to view indexes. But I still can't easily see if I have any redundant indexes.
The developer still deserves a kick to the groin area, but just not as hard now.
September 26, 2008 at 10:15 am
It's true that SSMS 2005 has its problems. My main peeve is the excessive memory resources it requires. I have often had to use Task manager to kill the SSMS process, after having managed to get SSMS to hang on something relatively benign.
To be fair though, there are some new nice features as well. Here is one: being able to monitor a job running in the little popup dialog, after having manually started it. In Enterprise Manager you would have to keep on clicking Refresh to check on job status.
As for index, use "sp_helpindex tblName" to check a table's indexes.
__________________________________________________________________________________
SQL Server 2016 Columnstore Index Enhancements - System Views for Disk-Based Tables[/url]
Persisting SQL Server Index-Usage Statistics with MERGE[/url]
Turbocharge Your Database Maintenance With Service Broker: Part 2[/url]
September 26, 2008 at 10:50 am
To be fair though, there are some new nice features as well. Here is one: being able to monitor a job running in the little popup dialog, after having manually started it. In Enterprise Manager you would have to keep on clicking Refresh to check on job status.
I still have to right click and then click refresh. It doesn't seem to update the status. I just tested this 1 min before I posted this.
September 26, 2008 at 11:08 am
Will Summers (9/26/2008)
To be fair though, there are some new nice features as well. Here is one: being able to monitor a job running in the little popup dialog, after having manually started it. In Enterprise Manager you would have to keep on clicking Refresh to check on job status.
I still have to right click and then click refresh. It doesn't seem to update the status. I just tested this 1 min before I posted this.
Yes, you only get the popup if you manually start a SQL job.
In EM 2000 that feature did not exist.
It's a small thing but does make life easier.
__________________________________________________________________________________
SQL Server 2016 Columnstore Index Enhancements - System Views for Disk-Based Tables[/url]
Persisting SQL Server Index-Usage Statistics with MERGE[/url]
Turbocharge Your Database Maintenance With Service Broker: Part 2[/url]
September 26, 2008 at 11:12 am
Planning and initial development of SQL 11 is going on. I'd file these on Connect (connect.microsoft.com) and get this in front of those people that will do the design. I know that doesn't help, but it might in the next upgrade.
Also, post the Connect link here and on your blog. Get people to vote since it makes a difference.
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September 26, 2008 at 11:31 am
Will Summers (9/26/2008)
I am in the process of upgrading our main production box from 2000 to 2005. I know 2005 has been out for a while, but we finally got our new server and I finally have some free time to upgrade it.My opinion of 2005 so far : I would love to find the main developer of Management Studio and give him a swift kick in the crotch.
Gripes:
1. Most DBAs have to manage indexes from time to time (sarcastic tone). It would be nice to be able to have easy access to a nice list of indexes and all of the columns they include in one screen - LIKE 2000 HAD. A good idea to bring this list up, would be . . . I don't know . . . maybe by right-clicking on a table then have it in the list? Is that just too obvious? Why do I have to go 'design' the table, then go view indexes? I won't even go into the dangers of someone editing a table just to change an index.
Click on a table, you'll see an Indexes tab under the table name, above Statistics and below Triggers. They didn't do what you want because they did something even easier.
2. The interface to manage indexes is horrible. They didn't even make the dialog box that comes up sizeable!!!! If I have a static table with many indexes, then I have to basically memorize them as I click on each one if I am trying to find any redundancy. I can't see what columns are referenced in one dialog box.
With the management views (new to SQL 2005), you can do things like:
select tables.name as TName, indexes.name as IName, columns.name as CName
from sys.tables
inner join sys.indexes
on tables.object_id = indexes.object_id
inner join sys.index_columns
on indexes.index_id = index_columns.index_id
inner join sys.columns
on index_columns.column_id = columns.column_id
order by TName, IName, CName
Queries like that, which can be reported against in SSRS, etc., are just too easy to use.
3. If I design a table that's already in place and I move the seperator bar up, then close the window, it doesn't remember where the bar was. If the table only has 3-5 columns, why not have the seperator bar up farther? This seems to be the standard throughout Management Studio.
Since I don't design tables in the GUI (I find it much easier to use T-SQL commands), I haven't run into this one. Does sound like a pain.
4. How do I easily view how much free data/trans space is in my database? The only way I've found through Management Studio so far is the Disk Usage report. This shows me how much space I have free per file, but I still have to add all of the numbers up to find the number of GB I have free in my database. What if I have 5-6 data files and I want to know how much total free space I have? The percentage doesn't do me much good if the percentage is something like 13.74% and my database size is 144.322GB. I would have to get a calculator out to find out the exact amount.
Right-click on the database name, select Properties, the first screen gives you the amount of free space available in the database.
5. The interface for viewing running jobs is ok, but to get to it is kind of a pain. It also doesn't remember the sizing changes I made to it when I closed it. If I click on Job Activity Monitor, wouldn't it make sense to show the Job Activity in the Object Explorer Details? Why when I start a job does it give me an extra dialog box to close? Just update the job's line in the activity monitor.
Not sure what you mean on this one. Double-click on the Job Activity Monitor, and you have all the data right there. At least, that's how it's worked on every machine I've used Management Studio on.
6. Why the hell would I want to open a browser window inside of management studio? If I am testing a website, then I want to see what it looks like to my users. Chances are my users don't have Management Studio installed so why would I want to test my webpage with it? The time spent putting this 'option' into Management Studio should have been put into usablity of the interface.
I haven't used this feature, but I can see the potential value to opening up MSDN within Management Studio. Not sure I ever would, but since it probably took about 10 lines of code to make it possible, I don't think it's that big a deal.
I'm really trying not to be negative about 2005, but I get the feeling that they are trying to make Management Studio more like Access. When I use Access I feel like I am trying to make fine art with crayons. I am a long time user of 2000 and started with SQL Server back before 6.5.
I think the same person that designed the Windows Mobile phone interface had a hand in designing Management Studio. (the Windows Mobile phone interface is horrible!!!)
I'm really hoping that 2005's 64bit engine really shines and makes up for the lackluster interface that I have to put up with. I've only been using the product for about 2-3 weeks, so hopefully my opinion will change in the future. Hopefully I'm just not finding these options and they are somewhere in the interface and I can retract these above statement.
When I switched from Query Analyzer and Enterprise Manager to Management Studio and Visual Studio, it was a pain for a few weeks. Maybe even a few months, but then I began to figure out why it is the way it is, and it all clicked, and I like it better now.
If you really can't get used to it, there are a number of third party apps, from the likes of RedGate and ApexSQL, that aim to make it easier for you to work with SQL Server of whatever flavor (2000/2005/2008/etc.). Maybe you should try those out.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
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September 26, 2008 at 1:16 pm
GSquared (9/26/2008)
Click on a table, you'll see an Indexes tab under the table name, above Statistics and below Triggers. They didn't do what you want because they did something even easier.
Um . . . that's great the you can just expand the table to show the indexes, but my point was that I can't compare the indexes side by side like in 2000. If they would have just taken the idea one step further and I had been able to expand the index and then see the columns that would have been nice. they should have added columns to the Object Explorer when I click on the index. Sure they did something easier - easier to for the developers of 2005 to implement.
I know that I can do many of these things through TSQL, but my point was that they gave us a new interface and didn't leave the same functionality in the new.
I usually don't create tables in the GUI, I just noticed it cause I had to go into the design to view the indexes.
I right clicked on the database, then properties. It says free space in database, is that log space or data space or a combo? Who knows? Combing the amount of free space is really a useless stat.
Job Activity Monitor -
It doesn't remember the sizing changes I made to it when I closed it. The dialog box doesn't come up big enough to show all columns at once and I can't show/hide columns. This is a pain.
If I click on Job Activity Monitor, wouldn't it make sense to show the Job Activity in the Object Explorer Details? Why when I start a job does it give me an extra dialog box to close? Why even have the extra box? Wouldn't it make more sense to just update the status?
I manage about 20-30 nightly jobs on my server. I am going to get real sick of closing that little dialog box everytime I have to manually start a job.
I'm hoping that I grow to love the new interface, but so far it's been a real let down (similar feelings as XP to Vista, and I ended going back to XP). When I went from 6.5 to 7 and to 2000 I don't remember disliking anything, though I know that this upgrade is a little more significant of a change.
September 26, 2008 at 2:26 pm
On the dialog box on jobs, that shows steps and status. The jobs data in the summary view doesn't update except when you click "Refresh". The pop-up one allows you to know when a job is done without having to constantly refresh the screen. If you don't like that, then send Microsoft a suggestion to make it optional.
On viewing indexes side-by-side, if you open the properties of two or more indexes, you can view them side-by-side. Right-click, Properties, move windows around as needed. I just tested, and there's a certain minimum size on the view given, but it can be expanded from that to show more columns. I'd be more inclined to query them and use a join to find duplicate columns, but if visually scanning is what you need, you can do it.
On the point of disk space use and availability, right-click the database, go to Reports, Standard Reports, Disk Usage. See if that gives you what you're looking for. Includes how much space is used in data files, how much is unused, how much is tables, how much is indexes, how much is unallocated. Same for log files. Can show on an individual file basis, if that's what you need. You can also build custom reports of your own and use those.
On Job Activity Monitor, yeah, the ability to hide/show columns would be nice, but I have to say that I can see all columns quite clearly on a simple 17" monitor.
My minor complaint about Management Studio is that I find the Object Explorer Details window completely useless to me and wish I could have the Object Explorer open on-start, without having that one open too. Not a big deal, but I do find it annoying that to get one, I'm stuck with the other.
Different people, different needs.
I find Management Studio adequate to my needs, you don't. I absolutely loathed Enterprise Manager, but I know lots of DBAs who like it. Heck, I even like Vista, and I'm in a very small minority on that one (though I think a lot of this is because of people buying into Mac's marketing hype).
I remember when I first started using Management Studio that there was something missing that seemed important to me at the time. I can distinctly remember thinking that. But I can't remember at all what was missing, so I guess it wasn't actually all that important in the long run, since I'm certainly able to get my job done without it.
- Gus "GSquared", RSVP, OODA, MAP, NMVP, FAQ, SAT, SQL, DNA, RNA, UOI, IOU, AM, PM, AD, BC, BCE, USA, UN, CF, ROFL, LOL, ETC
Property of The Thread
"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everyone agrees it's old enough to know better." - Anon
September 26, 2008 at 2:34 pm
Will Summers (9/26/2008)
To be fair though, there are some new nice features as well. Here is one: being able to monitor a job running in the little popup dialog, after having manually started it. In Enterprise Manager you would have to keep on clicking Refresh to check on job status.
I still have to right click and then click refresh. It doesn't seem to update the status. I just tested this 1 min before I posted this.
Once you open the Job activity monitor, click on the auto-refresh settings (little browser-like link on the mid-left of the screen). Set to the timeframe you wish. Click OK. KEEP monitor open, or your settings just got lost....(which by the way is the reason monitor opens into its own window from what I can tell.)
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Your lack of planning does not constitute an emergency on my part...unless you're my manager...or a director and above...or a really loud-spoken end-user..All right - what was my emergency again?
September 26, 2008 at 4:05 pm
When I first went from EM to SSMS a few years ago, I absolutely HATED SSMS ... couldn't stand it. Yet after about 6 months or so, I refused to ever use EM/QA again. It takes some time to get used to it, but once you get comfortable with it and you start to utilize the DMV's, you'll love it. I still manage a hybrid environment (2000 and 2005) and I must say, I really wish my SQL 2000 servers would just burn down. I can't stand 2000 at this point, so many limitations in comparison to 2005.
Give it time, you'll come around.
September 27, 2008 at 5:13 am
Adam Bean (9/26/2008)
When I first went from EM to SSMS a few years ago, I absolutely HATED SSMS ... couldn't stand it. Yet after about 6 months or so, I refused to ever use EM/QA again. It takes some time to get used to it, but once you get comfortable with it and you start to utilize the DMV's, you'll love it. I still manage a hybrid environment (2000 and 2005) and I must say, I really wish my SQL 2000 servers would just burn down. I can't stand 2000 at this point, so many limitations in comparison to 2005.Give it time, you'll come around.
Yep, that's also my experience.
The biggest issue is getting used to SSMS and the new tool set for SSIS.
As you can see, Will, you're not alone 😉
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